Transfer case output shaft wobbly

[Tedybear]

Ok, further down the rabbit hole.

1995 Explorer 4.0 Sport 2dr Standard 4wd. (stock)


Been chasing down a rather odd issue with the speedometer. Found the gear had minor, but interesting wear on it. So I just replaced it a few minutes ago. Keeping in mind each time I've worked on this, I've checked the U-Joints because we do have some odd shakes and whatnots. U-Joints and everything.

Up until this afternoon I've not noted anything loose. I was trying to research for myself a bit more, and discovered a lot of play in the output flange/shaft of the transfer case.

https://youtu.be/AMIi7rVqy5w

For you Video-a-holics. Pardon my breathing...It's not easy for a guy of my size to balance my cell phone camera, laying on my back, and using my other free hand to shake and wiggle the drive shaft.

Should I attempt to 'rebuild' the current transfer case? Or try to get lucky at the local pickypull yard for a decent used replacement. (runs about $85 for it) I felt this might explain the shifting problems we've had with the standard, but looks like this might just be isolated to the rear driveshaft flange/shaft.

Feedback welcome. I'm still driving it of course with a jumpy speedometer... But this does explain a lot of the odd shakes and sounds that I felt where just old worn out body mount bushings..... That much play is going to play shake rattle and roll...

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[Denisefwd93]

Tedy, it really looks like the flange is loose on the output shaft!

 

[Tedybear]

Tedy, it really looks like the flange is loose on the output shaft!

I can pull the rear drive shaft and verify the retaining nut is tight. Actually it might be even easier to remove the VSS and feel around for the drive gear for the sensor. Insert the finger against the gear and rock the flange around and see what has play. If the VSS drive gear has zero play and the flange is wobbly then that would be actually welcome. Hit the retaining nut with the socket and long breaker bar (my torque wrench won't go up as far as that thing should be torqued at)


But I will double check that next time I'm under the truck. I do hope it's that simple really... But so far nothing on this old girl has been simple and easy.

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[Tedybear]

Just for giggles.

Does anyone know exactly what size nut that uses to retain the flange? I've seen everything all over the map. I know it's gotta be a thin wall. 30mm seems to be the popular one, but people have listed all sorts of sizes! I'd like to tackle at least that part of it when I get home tonight from work.

Thanks!

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[Shran]

No idea what size the nut is as it has been several years since I took one off - but I am betting your output shaft bearing is gone. Have you drained the t-case? That might give you a pretty good idea of what's going on, if the fluid is full of metal then there's a good possibility that you need a rebuild or replacement.

I guess if it were me I would go the junkyard replacement route, $85 is pretty reasonable. Not that I would be afraid of rebuilding one but the parts are going to be more than $85...so...why.

If I remember right the speedo gear is driven by the output shaft so play in the latter would explain why it wore out.

 

[Andy D]

Any side play is bad. Yah, it needs fixing or just replacement. It definitely could be the source of noise and vibration. Depending on where you live, it could be body supports or rear spring hangers. Its a 21 yr old car, why do you think they are called clunkers ?

 

[Tedybear]

Any side play is bad. Yah, it needs fixing or just replacement. It definitely could be the source of noise and vibration. Depending on where you live, it could be body supports or rear spring hangers. Its a 21 yr old car, why do you think they are called clunkers ?

I call 'em something else....LOL

Okay, updates for the people!

It's 30mm. All our local parts house had was a 12 point socket.

Yeah that nut was CrAzY LoOsE! And of course, my breaker bar and torque wrench are about 20 miles north in the barn's tool room. And my CrapsMan 1/2 ratchet stripped.... But I did manage to get it snugged down about 3 turns. (Yeah....3) Before I started the knuckle banging.

As for play...Here's the depressing part. Up and down we still have about 1/8" play up and down. This was with me putting my finger between the U-Joints and resting my finger on the output shaft itself. Now the entire assembly has the play. (but I will also admit..not anywhere near as bad) I attempted side to side (L/R) for play, but that for some odd reason was tight? Shouldn't have been much of a leverage issue, but it looks like up/down is the issue. And of course that matches up with the Speedo gear problems. Shaft tilts down slightly and the gear drops contact. Give 'er the beans as they say...and the thing kicks up enough to work the shaft.

If I had to guess cause/effect as my mind works that way. Nut is loose creating wobble and all that. The shaking of the flange on the shaft would be enough to damage the bearing, as it would not be natural movement for it.

I took photos of the ID tags and such for the yard. Maybe I'll get lucky and find a transmission with the transfer case as a set. (hang on to that dream...)

Thanks again!!

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[Tedybear]

Wow...Did I call the wrong T/C.


Looks like when I need parts for the locally I'll have to request they look up a '96. (If I use my year of 1995 it kicks up the 1354 case)

It has ID tags of the following: 44-05-000-007
F57a-7a195-ca

Confirmed with the tag:

S/N A1652 4405-07
153028 f57A-CA I'm guessing at the "CA" part. The tag is hard to read on that corner.

So at least I found suppliers of the Speed O gear for a 4405. The shop guides all state this truck has a 1354 Transfer case. Thankfully the output seal interchanges.

However it seems like the one complaint on this one? The case/housing itself gets damaged and that would explain the wobble... I'll be checking into the picky pullers and seeing if I can get lucky with one off a wreck.

Thanks again!!

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(And how in the heck does anyone tighten that flange nut to 180-200 ftlbs?)

 

[OlBlue38]

THE PERFECTIONEST ARE GOING TO SCREAM. GET A 1/2 IN IMPACT WRENCH. Hold the flange with a big pipe wrench or big channel locks. Tighten away with that impact. When you put the drive shaft yoke back in place there probably will not be to much slack.

 

[Tedybear]

THE PERFECTIONEST ARE GOING TO SCREAM. GET A 1/2 IN IMPACT WRENCH. Hold the flange with a big pipe wrench or big channel locks. Tighten away with that impact. When you put the drive shaft yoke back in place there probably will not be to much slack.

LOL!


I'm pretty anal about torque specs. But I did consider nailing that with the impact gun. In reality the nut is snugged down fairly tight. The fact the shaft itself has up/down play points towards a known issue with the case itself. But I'm always up for adventure. If I can't find a replacement one in good shape, I'll likely get the new speedo gear off eBay and then nail the batcrap out of it with the impact. (Sorry to all the gearheads... I only own an Electric impact gun...)

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[trail B2]

Make sure to take a minute to check the oil level.I'm kinda thinking there should be oil leaking out of there.

 

[Shran]

THE PERFECTIONEST ARE GOING TO SCREAM. GET A 1/2 IN IMPACT WRENCH. Hold the flange with a big pipe wrench or big channel locks. Tighten away with that impact. When you put the drive shaft yoke back in place there probably will not be to much slack.

Yeah, slight problem with that method, no matter how much you tighten it, you won't remove the slop. The nut is only there to hold the yoke on, not to preload the bearing.

If you can't find a good t-case at the junkyard try at www.car-part.com or buy a bearing & seal kit and rebuild it. They are not terribly complicated.

 

[Tedybear]

When we first got this red beast the fluids where checked and changed when needed. (yeah...all fluids except the front diff got changed.....pretty disgusting)

The transfer case was about 2/3 of a qt low. So I did top it off with Mercon V and we wound up changing it a week later. It wasn't in bad shape when we changed it. (The transmission is another story..that's a basket case all it's own)

What annoys me about this whole situation is that the P/O mentioned the speedometer gear being bad when I purchased it. Normally to me at least- that means the gear on the VSS.

It makes sense now that the P/O did remove the flange and figured out the drive gear on the shaft was bad--and he also figured out the wobble and the output shaft 'hole' being out of round was the cause.

If the yard does not have a workable transfer case. (ours is a manual. All the ones at the yard are auto trans. Should be the same regardless provided the ID's match?) Likely the wobble is the case itself being rounded out.

Would that be something that can be addressed in a rebuild? I've checked Car-Part already. A local yard has one for about $300. That's sadly out of our budget. We still need to spring for a set of tires as I'm using my old rock tires off the Bronco II and wheels off that truck.

Not to mention the fact the transmission likes to shift great one second..and hard as he&& the next. (And this is engine not running as well) Heck, maybe I can get lucky and stretch the budget enough and find a trans mated to a transfer case. That is unlikely, as one of the first parts the "Flippers" grab would be those stick shifts for resale on eBay.

Keep the ideas coming. Maybe someone has fixed that out of round issue in the past?

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[Denisefwd93]

There is/was a manual T-case here on the classified Tedy. I've had one for sale for 6 months or so (electric no speedo connection)

 

[Shran]

Likely the wobble is the case itself being rounded out.

Would that be something that can be addressed in a rebuild?

Possible? Sure. Likely, no. Far more likely that the bearing itself is worn, not the case.

It is a big assumption to think that the bearing is spinning inside the case and has egged out the hole. You need to tear the t-case down and examine it before you know for sure, you may just need to replace that bearing.