• Welcome Visitor! Please take a few seconds and Register for our forum. Even if you don't want to post, you can still 'Like' and react to posts.

To swap or Not to swap. . .


Broosedamoose

Active Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2012
Messages
362
Reaction score
115
Points
43
Location
South East Massachusettes
Vehicle Year
2007
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
4.0 V6
Engine Size
4.0L SOHC
Transmission
Automatic
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Tire Size
31 x 10.5
My credo
Coming in second just makes you the first loser!
So most of what I found using the search button comes from older threads. I am quickly coming to the point where I need to do something about the engine in my 03. I had planned to do the Explorer V8 swap (actually have the donor already) but after seeing what can be done with the 4.0 SOHC these days, I'm undecided now! I found an "off road" performance 4.0 on eBay that the builder claims is pushing 290-300 HP for $6,800. There are stroker kits, supercharger kits, heads, cams and a whole slew of performance internals for the SOHC now. I know it would be cheaper to build a 302 and can easily get that HP rating but to think of having a V6 and the original engine laying down over 300 HP; that would be impressive. I have another year to think about it because i live in MA and they follow the same emission standards as CA but only on vehicle less than 15 years old. So once I get my sticker next year I am in the clear. I'm still leaning towards the V8 just because I have always loved the distinct sound of the Ford 302. Looking for a few opinions. What would "you" do if you were in my position?
 


RonD

Official TRS AI
TRS Technical Advisor
Joined
Jun 2, 2012
Messages
25,291
Reaction score
8,293
Points
113
Location
canada
Vehicle Year
1994
Make / Model
Ford
Transmission
Manual
"There is no replacement for displacement"

This has always been true and always will be true, as far as power is concerned.

Practical use also has its place.
4cyl turbo can get the MPG for Daily Driving and have the gas guzzling power when needed.

I think your lean towards V8 is valid.
Pushing a 4.0l(or 4.3l) SOHC too close to its limit will most likely shorten its life span.

5.0l OHV takes the extra power better if you are even going to build it, and parts will be cheaper because there are more makers of parts for 5.0l/(302)

Benefit to the 4.0l is that the computer and wiring stays stock, trans as well but.........might need to beef it up, where the 5.0l has to use different trans in the swap.
So you are really just talking computer and wiring as the extra cost.

If I had a vote, and emissions is not a concern, then 5.0l

Also check about DMV titles, you can get saddled with "rebuilt" on the title in some states if engine size changes
 

win

Member
U.S. Military - Veteran
V8 Engine Swap
Joined
Jan 13, 2014
Messages
335
Reaction score
12
Points
18
Vehicle Year
2002
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Size
5.0
Transmission
Automatic
Can be a tough call. The SOHC 4.0 and 5.0 both put out simular power and the 4.0 is an OEM option.

The Expo 5.0 and its 4R70W are easier, less expensive to get even more performance with a higher potential.
 

RonD

Official TRS AI
TRS Technical Advisor
Joined
Jun 2, 2012
Messages
25,291
Reaction score
8,293
Points
113
Location
canada
Vehicle Year
1994
Make / Model
Ford
Transmission
Manual
Just for the record, the 4.0l SOHC has 9.7:1 compression ratio, so can't get max horse power with 87 octane.
It has a knock sensor that retards spark when regular gas is used.

I would say 185-190HP on regular gas
205HP on 93 octane

5.0l has 9.0:1, so 210HP on regular gas, no difference with 93 octane
 

Broosedamoose

Active Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2012
Messages
362
Reaction score
115
Points
43
Location
South East Massachusettes
Vehicle Year
2007
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
4.0 V6
Engine Size
4.0L SOHC
Transmission
Automatic
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Tire Size
31 x 10.5
My credo
Coming in second just makes you the first loser!
Yeah, I am leaning towards the V8 since I already have the donor sitting in my yard and the $6,800 I would spend on the 4.0 engine would go a long way building a 302. My truck is a 4WD so I'm not looking to build a racer out of it. I just want something fun (or funner) to drive. I mean, my truck is already fun to drive with just the bolt on's and the tunes Doug wrote for me many moons ago at the birth of BAMA! It impresses everyone who rides in it. I wanna push it to the next level though. Thanks for your though! They are much appreciated! :icon_thumby:
 
Last edited:

Broosedamoose

Active Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2012
Messages
362
Reaction score
115
Points
43
Location
South East Massachusettes
Vehicle Year
2007
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
4.0 V6
Engine Size
4.0L SOHC
Transmission
Automatic
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Tire Size
31 x 10.5
My credo
Coming in second just makes you the first loser!
Just for the record, the 4.0l SOHC has 9.7:1 compression ratio, so can't get max horse power with 87 octane.
It has a knock sensor that retards spark when regular gas is used.

I would say 185-190HP on regular gas
205HP on 93 octane

5.0l has 9.0:1, so 210HP on regular gas, no difference with 93 octane
I only run 93 and from only a few stations that I trust. The tune I have loaded is called "93BadBoy" and requires no less than 93 or it WILL ping! I believe it squeezes every last horse out of the truck! Doug really knew his stuff when it came to tuning these engines!
 

RonD

Official TRS AI
TRS Technical Advisor
Joined
Jun 2, 2012
Messages
25,291
Reaction score
8,293
Points
113
Location
canada
Vehicle Year
1994
Make / Model
Ford
Transmission
Manual
I only run 93 and from only a few stations that I trust. The tune I have loaded is called "93BadBoy" and requires no less than 93 or it WILL ping! I believe it squeezes every last horse out of the truck! Doug really knew his stuff when it came to tuning these engines!
EDIT: that should have read ADVANCE spark timing to avoid pinging/pre-ignition


Image all the money you could save and put into a 5.0l that can run on 87 octane and have even more power :)

87 octane and 93 octane have exactly the same power released when burned in an engine.
87 just self-ignites at a lower temperature, so in higher compression(more heat) engines spark timing has to be adjusted to prevent pre-ignition, which lowers power since full ignition happens to close to TDC.

Under 9.3:1 compression ratio 87 octane is usually fine assuming good engine condition and fuel mix.
So 9.0:1, 5.0l has same horse power(a little more) on 87 octane as the 4.0l SOHC on 93 octane, and can be built up for even more HP, still using the same 87 octane.

"No replacement for displacement" :)

If running in a racing category that has displacement limits then it makes since to get as much power as possible from limited displacement, but other than that go for the lower compression(cheaper to drive) bigger engine every time, IMO :)
 
Last edited:

RangerSVT

Oct 09 OTOTM
Article Contributor
V8 Engine Swap
OTOTM Winner
Solid Axle Swap
RBV's on Boost
ASE Certified Tech
TRS Banner 2010-2011
TRS Banner 2012-2015
Joined
Mar 15, 2009
Messages
7,883
Reaction score
53
Points
48
Location
TRS since 2002 - NW KY
Vehicle Year
19962002
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Size
GT-40 5.0L EFI W/AC
Transmission
Automatic
Something else to think about that will seal the deal, the 5r55 trans dont live long high power engines. The 4R70W is a lot stronger and more reliable with the power increases..

SVT
 

Broosedamoose

Active Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2012
Messages
362
Reaction score
115
Points
43
Location
South East Massachusettes
Vehicle Year
2007
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
4.0 V6
Engine Size
4.0L SOHC
Transmission
Automatic
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Tire Size
31 x 10.5
My credo
Coming in second just makes you the first loser!
Something else to think about that will seal the deal, the 5r55 trans dont live long high power engines. The 4R70W is a lot stronger and more reliable with the power increases..

SVT
Yes, that was my other concern! I knew I'd have to do something because it wouldn't hold up. Y'all have convinced me to do the swap!:icon_thumby:
 

Broosedamoose

Active Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2012
Messages
362
Reaction score
115
Points
43
Location
South East Massachusettes
Vehicle Year
2007
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
4.0 V6
Engine Size
4.0L SOHC
Transmission
Automatic
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Tire Size
31 x 10.5
My credo
Coming in second just makes you the first loser!
Now once I do the swap, do you think I should stick with EFI and the tuner set up or just go with a carburetor! I've heard diffrent stories; some same you can get more power with a well tuned carb while others say you get more power and a lot more options with EFI! My plan was to stick with the EFI mainly because of the different tunes you can use. I know a carb is hard to set and can't compensate for temp., altitude, etc. but is much simpler than EFI. What's y'all opinion about that?
 
Last edited:

RonD

Official TRS AI
TRS Technical Advisor
Joined
Jun 2, 2012
Messages
25,291
Reaction score
8,293
Points
113
Location
canada
Vehicle Year
1994
Make / Model
Ford
Transmission
Manual
EFI, no contest.

Carbs are "in tune" for a day or week, like you said depending on temp and air pressure

And they are not simpler, EFI is, carbs are much more complex with more things that can go wrong, but people often feel more comfortable working on a carb because they did it for many years, because they had to, with EFI there are rarely problems so it is almost like the first time any time there is a problem, lol.

Power wise there can't be a difference, fuel mix wise, assuming you have control over EFI system, just like with carb tuning you can set it for MPG or Power, and with computer control you also have spark advance control, which can also be setup for best MPG or best power, also octane.
 
Last edited:

win

Member
U.S. Military - Veteran
V8 Engine Swap
Joined
Jan 13, 2014
Messages
335
Reaction score
12
Points
18
Vehicle Year
2002
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Size
5.0
Transmission
Automatic
Simply put, the Explorer/Mountaineer EFI with its sequential fuel injectors and coil pack ignition was the most advanced system Ford ever dropped onto the Windsor.

Why go backwards? EFI might "look" more complicated and before OBD systems, might well have beeb harder to diagnose and repair but those days are long gone.
 

Sponsored Ad


Sponsored Ad

Staff online

Member & Vendor Upgrades

For a small yearly donation, you can support this forum and receive a 'Supporting Member' banner, or become a 'Supporting Vendor' and promote your products here. Click the banner to find out how.

Truck of The Month


Kirby N.
March Truck of The Month

Recently Featured

Want to see your truck here? Share your photos and details in the forum.

Follow TRS On Instagram

TRS Events

25th Anniversary Sponsors

Check Out The TRS Store


Sponsored Ad


Sponsored Ad

Sponsored Ad


Amazon Deals

Top