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Problems in the rear end


91stranger

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So here is what happened starting Friday. Friday I had my alternator lock up on my way to work and I was lucky enough to get a motorcraft re-man alternator while I was at work. I got that installed on my lunch break no problem. On my way to take the core back I noticed a grinding sound whenever I let off the gas pedal. I let it go hoping to just get home at this point. It got worse the more I drove. When I got home I saw oil all over the rear end and splashed onto the gas tank and what not. So I have a bad pinion seal. No biggie. Took it apart and there was nothing left except a few pieces of rubber. Took it out and cleaned it off. Put the new seal on and then started on the diff fluid. Drained a whopping 1/4 of a single quart from the diff.... Then as I'm cleaning the diff cover I see rust holes along the edge..... So luckily I got some blue rtv and silicone the hell out of it. Got that put back on and now the damn fill plug is rounded out due to the amount of rust on this damn rear end. So I have a few dilemma's now....
1-diff cover has holes.
2-Can't get the fill plug out so now I gotta buy fill plugs to drill into the diff cover.
3-I feel like I am missing something between the pinion seal and the pinion or flange. Tried finding a break down of the pinion seal to see if I'm missing anything but haven't found much yet.
4-I did NOT torque the pinion nut as tight as it was when I took it off as I don't know if it should be THAT tight. When I took it off I counted 5 threads and I only put it on up to 3 threads.

A whole new explorer rear end is sounding like a plan or at least another ranger rear end with a lot less rust. Any ideas? I've never replaced this specific seal before so I don't know what all should be in there around the pinion and flange.
 

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Dirtman

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When you take the pinion nut off to do a seal you need to mark the threads and put it back EXACTLY where it was. The pinion nut sets the pinion gear depth in relation to the ring gear, the original torque when initially installing it is MASSIVE. If you dont do this, you need to reset the whole damn thing.

As for the fill plug. You can just buy a rubber plug and drill a hole in the cover but make sure you drill at the right height.
 
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ericbphoto

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Wow.

1. If you only put that nut back on 3 out of 5 threads, it's too loose. It needs to be tight to maintain the bearing preload. But I don't know a good way to get the right torque without doing the proper setup procedure on that.

2. Some of those pinions have a kind of "slinger" between the seal and the flange. I forgot to reinstall the one on my 8.8 but I don't think it's really that important. More like a splash shield kind of thing.
 

91stranger

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When I tried to tighten the pinion nut it was getting extremely tight. Like so tight that the flange wouldn't move so I backed it off to the point where I could move the flange by hand. Before taking off the pinion nut I tried marking it with a permanent marker, memorizing how many threads were showing and I "tightened" the nut to see how "tight" it was before I took it off. As to my luck the permanent marker didn't like rust and didn't leave a mark at all. My plan was to get a rubber plug for the diff cover and just drill the hole the same height at the fill plug. I just don't think the pinion seal is right. I broke my phone just now too by dropping it 1' onto a counter top and it fell face down on some metal tracks and now the one side of my phone doesn't do anything and the other side is just pushing buttons.... Which pissed me off...…. Which led to me throwing the phone on the ground and breaking it into 3 pieces! So back to the pinion. All the gears looked good and metal shavings or sharp edges or gouges in the gears. I just think I'm missing something still between the pinion seal and the flange.
 

19Walt93

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If it was grinding the rear end is already damaged, you're describing a pinion bearing failure. The pinion nut needs to be tight enough to preload the bearings- I use a 1/2" impact- it does not regulate the depth, the internal shims do that. The old guy(probably younger than I am now) who ran the shop when I started in 1975 told me a tight bearing will very seldom fail, a loose bearing will always fail. Not to rub salt in the wound but the rear end plug should have been removed to check the level during every service and should never be rusted in place.
 

ericbphoto

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Yup. What he said ^^^. You just don’t want to apply enough torque to further distort the crush sleeve past it’s original setup.

But... if you’re laying under the truck hanging on the wrench, you won’t apply that much torque (in the neighborhood of 175? ft-lbs).
 

Josh B

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That does look like a serious rust issue, in addition to the other problems, so I think your idea of another rear end might be right on.
It would also be a good idea to thoroughly inspect your other axle, frame, and body for it too
 

91stranger

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Well this is an Ohio truck and the previous owner neglected the frame and anything underneath the body. When I got it I had plans of changing the fluid but between work, kids, and regular repairs I never had time to service the rear end and was hoping it was fine since it had been done in the past since I could see rtv sealant around the rear diff. When I got the truck it only had 99k so I figured it had just been done recently. I know better than to drain fluid before you have a way of putting it back in but I had to drain it no matter what. Trust me, if I could have prevented this much rust I would but I can't fix rust when it was neglected for so long. As for the pinion. Should I go ahead and tighten the nut to the 5 threads I counted before I took it off even though it feels like it is locking the pinion and flange?
 

ericbphoto

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This is sounding more and more like you have a serious problem in there. Do you have the axle up on jack stands with the wheels off the ground? If so, with the transmission in neutral, you should be able to rotate the pinion and feel/listen for roughness or grinding. If everything is good, you should be able to torque the pinion nut back to its original position.
 

91stranger

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Yes I did that and it moves smoothly and doesn't sound like anything is grinding or catching. I wish my phone didn't break because I took a lot of pictures of the gears. This is my luck. It goes from bad to worse, then really bad and even worse..... I think I may have put the pinion seal on backwards. It's hard replacing stuff when it is completely gone and you have no reference. Yes there's pictures online but I couldn't find one that looked exactly like mine.
 

91stranger

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Can anyone tell me which way the pinion seal goes in? I believe I have it in the right way but the diagrams suck and my chiltons book doesn't explain this part in great detail. I can get a picture from google if needed. I'd hate to tear up a seal if it just needs turned around.
 

ericbphoto

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It will only go in one way. This is a similar axle. But a good photo.

6E2824AF-E082-4AB0-BB71-3E66487C1E77.gif
 

91stranger

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See that's what I thought but it will NOT fit in this way. Could I have gotten the wrong part? Sucks when your original parts are so bad you cant use them for a reference.
 

ericbphoto

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It doesn’t just slide in. You have to drive it in - carefully, evenly, little by little, being carefull to avoid letting it get cocked. A hammer and wooden dowel work well. Do not tap on the rubbery parts.
 

91stranger

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Well I found a rear end for my truck finally. A buddy of mine' s dad has a junk yard and luckily he had a couple in the yard and he's going to pull an axle for me. I mentioned wanting leaf springs too so he is getting me the axle and both leaf packs for $100. He said he doesn't think he had any 4.10's or limited slip rear ends but for the price I can actually get my truck on the road again. I told him to just take the whole rear end out with the leaf springs still attached to the axle in case I get lazy and just want to throw the whole thing in instead of taking both sets of leaf springs apart so I can beef up the rear suspension.
 

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