Lotsa cash spent and not making any more power??

[Dan B.]

OK...I've got some issues...other than the voices in my head!!

Years ago when I first built the Ranger it would run 14.14@95mph in the 1/4 mile. The main parts consisted of a .030" over 351W, WP 2.02/1.60 heads, KB pistons, .450" lift truck cam, Edelbrock Performer intake, Prolator fuiel pump, stock ignition, iron manifolds, bent 2" pipes, Carter AFB 625, 3.23 gears, and 28" street tires.

Over the last 18 months I have changed....

The cam from the .450" to a .512" Crane.
The carb from the Carter 625 to a Holley 750.
The ignition from completely stock to completely MSD.
The pump from the Purolator to Holley Red.
The exhaust from mani's to TP Headers.
The pipes fom 2" to 3".
The gears from 3.23 to 3.55.
The tires from 28" radials to 26" Mickey ET Street.

A year ago it ran close to mid-13's w/ the stock ingition and mani's. The headers and ignition were changed over the winter. So I go to the track on Wednesday night and expect big things since she can now fully burn and exhale the spent gases....only to have the dam thing run an amazing 14.1@98mph!!! WTF!!! The 60, 330, 1/8 and 1/4 times are indentical as the old set up with the mph being up a hair on each.

Late in the night I ran into a fella running a VERY similar 351W but his was dragging along in a '69 Mach I. It was running a very similar cam but less compression that mine (9.5:1 vs 10.7:1). With 3.90 gears and 28" tires, he was running deep in the 12's. My gears are 3.55's and tires are 26" so that should be a wash. His car was fully dressed and should be much heavier than the Ranger.

The only big difference in our set ups was the timing. I did not know where to set mine so when I installed the MSD it was at 30 BTDC so I left it there. This guy was running 34 BTDC and went 12.6 sec then bumped it to 36 BTDC and went 12.4 seconds. He said with my compression, I oughta be running 38 BTDC and go from there.

Would that be the big problem that I am not making power?? I am seriously disappointed that I dumped all that cash to go a blazing 3mph faster!!

 

[superdave1984]

I would be skeptical of that Mustang. The 69 I had was way more powerful engine wise with a 351 Cleveland and LOTS of goodies and it would only hit the mid 13's. I am thinking he had a little squeeze on there somewhere

 

[wizkid00104]

Perhaps the tranny is the culprit....

 

[baddad457]

As for the carb, you should have gained a few poines. Not a lot but a few. Might want to spend time tuning the carb and making sure the secondaries are opening. The ignition swap? Absolutely Nothing gained there if you swapped from Duraspark to MSD. Ditto on the fuel pump, the purolator was plenty. Went too big on exhaust diameter, 2-1/2" was plenty. I suspect you're loosing out from traction issues, same as mine did, what was the 60' time? And also have to remember that 69 Stang is also lighter and more aerodynamic than your Ranger. The Performer intake is also a bottleneck.

 

[Dan B.]

Dave...he was on all motor...I looked it over good. I saw the slips and watched him go through the traps at 12.4.

Wizkid...I let a life long racer driver the truck prior to the header swap and he liked the way it shifted. Said it pulled good and shifted firm.

Baddad...traction is not an issue. It plants the tires well when I put enough heat into them. My 60's are in the 2.10's with an occassional 2.09. The carb is a vacuum advance but I swapped in the lightest spring possible for the last pass and ran identical times are the three prior that had a medium/heavy spring. And are you really serious that the MSD has absolutely no benefit over stock Duraspark?

You really think that '69 Mustang weighs less than 3200#??

 

[doorgunner]

2" exhaust......the pressure alone coming outta those pipes will push you to the finish line 0.5 seconds & 9 mph faster....

seriously.....2" exhausts........

wut about mufflers????????????

 

[Mac]

Had some time so I pulled this up; A lot depends on body style but seems to be really close to what you had mentioned. Add 100hp and a good gear.


Hard-to-find FACTORY STOCK 1969 Ford Mustang Mach 1 specifications (for the 290 horsepower 4 barrel carb 351 Windsor model such as

108 in wheelbase
58.5 in track both front and rear
187.4 in long
71.8 in wide
50.3 in tall
3571 lb curb weight
20 US Gallons fuel tank capacity
290.0 bhp @4800 rpm
385 lbft torque @3200 rpm
0-60 mph in 7.5 seconds
Quarter-mile from standing start in 15.6 seconds at 88 mph
179.01 bhp/ton power-to-weight ratio
F70 x 14 tire sizes front and rear
1.00 top gear ratio
3.25 final drive ratio

 

[kemicalburns]

what tranny are you running?

the Iron manifolds are not helping anything and are a choking point for sure.
you might think about throwing the old carb back on there to see if anything changes.

 

[Dan B.]

Mufflers are a single baffle race style. OK...so I may have gone a bit extreme here but man, when you start bending 2", and even 2.5", it really shrinks down fast. I thought the 3" when bent would close it up somewhat and still be ok. Guess not. Better get my 427 stoker built then to use the big pipes!!

Tranny is a well built C4 w/ TCI 2200 stall convertor.

I'm not running manifolds anymore. Currently have Total Performance headers.

I still don't get that the MSD system was not an improvement.

And the tire/gear swap...I gained nothing! I'm just baffled.

 

[99RangerBoss]

i woulda stuck with the old carb and smaller exhaust pipes to keep your exhaust gas velocity higher especially since your running headers now so your exhaust gas pulses will actually be timed some what correctly. btw what compression are you running?

 

[rocks]

Dyno it check the a/f ratio rejet the carb. if you dont have a dyno near by get a wide band gauge and sensor with logging. Log it and rejet the carb. Tune by ear does not work. Prob running really rich or really lean.

 

[Dan B.]

99Boss....compression is 10.7:1.

rocks...there is a Wyotech just down the road. I may be able to get in there for a day on the rollers. That's my first route. After that I will be going the sensor way you mentioned. That way I could retune based on any changes made w/o needing to pull back on the dyno.

But another item.......talk to me about vacuum secondaries. I'm thinking they may not be working properly. I forgot to mention that on the last pass I swapped out a medium/heavy spring for the lightest spring in the pack just to see what would happen. That pass was exactly, I mean EXACTLY, the same as the rest. That leads me to think the secondaries are not opening. What is the best place to hook into? There is a large port on the rear of the carb, one small one on the passenger side of the front bowl and one under the front bowl angled to the passenger side.

 

[baddad457]

Baddad...traction is not an issue. It plants the tires well when I put enough heat into them. My 60's are in the 2.10's with an occassional 2.09. The carb is a vacuum advance but I swapped in the lightest spring possible for the last pass and ran identical times are the three prior that had a medium/heavy spring. And are you really serious that the MSD has absolutely no benefit over stock Duraspark?

You really think that '69 Mustang weighs less than 3200#??

My 60ft times were something like 2.20 which everyone told me wasn't that good. I'm by no means a pro drag racer though. There's a way to check the vacuum secondary for function by placing a screw in the linkage, just the exact way escapes me at the moment. And yes, the Duraspark IS that good. Now, points to MSD or Duraspark, you might see a good bit of difference, but not from Duraspark to MSD. And that 69 Stang could weigh under 3000# depending on what's in it compared to what it had when it left the factory.

 

[baddad457]

But another item.......talk to me about vacuum secondaries. I'm thinking they may not be working properly. I forgot to mention that on the last pass I swapped out a medium/heavy spring for the lightest spring in the pack just to see what would happen. That pass was exactly, I mean EXACTLY, the same as the rest. That leads me to think the secondaries are not opening. What is the best place to hook into? There is a large port on the rear of the carb, one small one on the passenger side of the front bowl and one under the front bowl angled to the passenger side.

You're confusing the vacuum advance with the vac. secondary. The vac advance hose from the distributor plugs into the port on the pass side of the main metering block. That's not the vacuum secondary. The vacuum secondary pod takes the vacuum from inside the throttle body, under the venturis. Also when replacing the sec spring, it's also possible to get the vacuum diaphram out of place, blocking the vacuum port in the pod.

 

[Dan B.]

I know its not exactly apples to apples but I pull high 1.8's in the 60ft on my Bandit 1250 and its runs out the back door in the low 11.30's at 116mph. Some old slips from the original Ranger set up as listed way above are in the low 2.0's (.030, 029, 031). This has me thinking that the secondaries on this Holley may not be coming in at all if I'm in the 2.1's.

I just remembered...the pass it made last year in the mid-13's was with the secondaries bolted to pull open with the primaries at half throttle. I did that thinking the 2nds were coming in slow. This was the last pass I made before this week. Since then I got the quick change top for the spring housing I removed the bolt and swapped in lighter springs. I bet the secondaries are the problem. I'll call Holley Tech on Monday and see what I have hooked up wrong.

Thanks for being my sounding board..........I'll post up the details when I get this garbage resolved.